This is an open letter to the site owners. Problems and annoyances with the site have reached critical mass.


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bulshoy, on 10/22/2007 1:26:56 PM
Total Posts: 4317, Joined: 11/15/2005
"And the fact that articles that aren't on front page don't get shouts might be an indication something has to change in the shouting-sytem."

Any suggestions? (not just directed at you, but everyone)

BTW, I have cleaned up the submissions pages to a spit-and-polish shine. Check it out if you get a second:

http://www.shoutwire.com/shoutstories

Oh, and I AM going to re-promote this at about 4:30 EST, not because I spent lots of time writing it, but I want the evening ShoutWire members to see this too.
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gakhandal, on 10/22/2007 1:33:18 PM
Total Posts: 40, Joined: 1/11/2006
Amen, Definitely agree with everything, great article.

And I'd like to compare the recent activities with another dear (ex) site of mine, tvtome. True story.

TvTome.com was a site dedicated to index tv shows, guides, episode guides and episode listing to the masses. (You can call it a wiki type-o-site, but it predates wikipedia)

Well Tvtome, about 2 years ago, got sold to c|net. C|net changed the entire site. Including its name to tv.com. In tv.com, ads, flash ads, bugs and poor moderating systems were (are) out of control. The site takes about the same time to load as it dose to load here (in recent weeks that is). They also have a redirecting issue; The moderating/administration system are simply crazy you cannot say one bad thing or go out of line without being threatened with a ban or suspension. you get many crazy bugs, and crappy ads to top it off. This led very loyal users of the old tvtome to leave the site compliantly, and others went on to other rival sites, or created their own tvtome type of site out of the void and outrage that was tvtome has become. (namely one, tvrage.com)

Moral of the story is, don't sell your company/sites to douchebags, they'll fuck it up more then it already was, and you'll loose loyal users to.

And this isn't an indirect insult the current owners of this site, its only an example of what happened to tvtome.
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Immaculate1, on 10/22/2007 2:12:28 PM
Total Posts: 4881, Joined: 7/16/2006
@gakhandal

Yeah I know tvtome, it was an excellent user driven site, and I used it daily.

God, what do I hate TV.com. They completely fucked the site up. That was the first time I was introduced to the phenomenon where ordinary people make a website great, get traffic, and then big money jumps in and COMPLETELY FUCKS IT UP FOR EVERYBODY. Everybody hates TV.com now, especially the common people who edited the information for a specific tv series.

Worst is, they also bought the second ranking most decent episode guide website, epguides.com

Oh man, what would I hate to see this happen to ShoutWire.

-------

@Bulshoy, great article. You say almost everything there is to say.

First, fuck the Romanians.

Second, everybody please pay attention, people SHOULD SHOUT NEW ARTICLES. It is a real problem this isn't done enough. I also think the link "Shout Articles" isn't clear enough. When I was a new user it took me some time to figure out that that button directed me to newly posted content. Perhaps more people have this.

Maybe a caption like "View new submissions" or something like that would work better, and it should be placed more central on the page in a better visible spot, so that people who aren't familiar with it can discover it more easily.

Not getting articles shouted is a real turn-off for submitters. I myself submitted 49 articles in September, only a staggering _3_ articles made it to the front page. I tell you, that's not a big incentive to keep posting articles. Honestly, I was rather disappointed.

To get an idea of how much people shout articles these days, I checked a couple of days through the first 20 pages of the new submissions, to discover that most articles get stuck on only 3 or 4 shouts max, above 6 was rare, and above 10 was extremely rare. No wonder everything gets auto-deleted after 5 days. I remember, a year ago, there where much more shouts on the newly submitted pages.

Another idea I have is to make a ShoutWire help page, or perhaps a better word, a manual. SW has a couple of features that are locked away behind some button somewhere, without reaching the users who aren't too familiar with everything. I think the site could use a page that explains to users what all the things are you can do here on ShoutWire, and what is needed to get the best experience out of SW, namely submitting and shouting new articles, instead of only just concentrating on the front page.

You could post this page say like one day in the week on the front page. I think that a lot of people then might get a better idea of everything this site is about and what you can do here.
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nodnarb232001, on 10/22/2007 2:18:53 PM
Total Posts: 909, Joined: 8/20/2006
@cowpants

*whispering* PSSSSSST! My screen name is nodnarb232001, not just nodnarb.

I agree, this is fun.
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Dock, on 10/22/2007 2:39:34 PM
Total Posts: 1483, Joined: 11/12/2005
@ Peenmaster

Actually, it's been the opposite. There needs to be more folks shouting and submitting stories, uploading, etc...

Hopefully being able to browse by category and finally having this site fast will help everyone doing that.
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meh., on 10/22/2007 2:41:57 PM
Total Posts: 4416, Joined: 9/5/2006
^

^

Brandon the epic looser?
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bushpresident4life, on 10/22/2007 2:46:00 PM
Total Posts: 433, Joined: 7/7/2007
shoutwire owners:


just ignore the crybabies on the site. i think you're doing one hell of a job. you see, the more ads you come at us with, the more hippies leave in frustration. they don't understand the concept of business. if anything i hope we get alot more ads, and i mean alot more.


ok now. someone mentioned the lack of shouts on articles. do you know why that is? because most of the articles suck. all we get is ron paul, anti-american propaganda and drug addicts. good articles get shouted, bad ones don't. it really is that simple.
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ShanusMaximus, on 10/22/2007 2:47:36 PM
Total Posts: 881, Joined: 1/30/2006
@bulshoy
All of the problems that you have addressed are EXACTLY why I have not been coming to this site as much. I can't change my avatar, getting articles shouted is nearly impossible (most of the regulars do, but it just isn't enough) and when you look at the CRAP you have to sift through just to find something worth a shit to shout...no wonder. Plus load times aggrevating enough to punch your monitor. If something could be done with the Romanian Mafia...DO IT!
One other thing....Am I the only one a that wants to kill user DanandJennifer? These fuckers clog up the "find articles to shout" page with like 20 or more stupid dating articles. I am not saying that they should be banned, but man, there should be a limit to how many articles can be submitted in one day to keep things a little more lean.
If these things could be fixed, I would gladly submit more articles, come to the site more, shout more and comment more and who knows.....maybe buy something from one of your advertisers. However the way things are right now, fuggeda 'bout it.

Haven't given up all hope yet......
ShanusMaximus

P.S. Keep up the good fight, Bulshoy.
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Peenmeister, on 10/22/2007 2:53:51 PM
Total Posts: 361, Joined: 3/29/2006
@ Bulshoy

"
"And the fact that articles that aren't on front page don't get shouts might be an indication something has to change in the shouting-sytem."

Any suggestions? (not just directed at you, but everyone)"

Still thinking about it. Functionality is already pretty good but even with all the extra features, it's still unlikely that many people ever see the non-promoted articles, even though it's easier than before because of the 'recent submissions' tab.

One way could be to eventually ban people that abuse the system, or create a way of disabling shouts from certain people to others. However this might not solve the biggest part of the problem.

Also the 'video's you must see' section doesn't seem to add much imho.

The system is no longer really People-Powered, and according to Tubearoo's/Shoutwire's mission statement it should be. Looks like the people driving this mean machine have no idea how to maintain it and how to achief their mission.

BTW. Tubearoo's Stock Quote looks pretty grimm, looks like a new server isn't likely judging from that. Stocks went from 4.40 to 0.45 in a year.

http://www.tubearoo.com/Investors?page=StockQuote

@ dockwats

Totally agree, there do need to be more people shouting and submitting, did I say something else anywhere? If I find the time I might consider submitting some things as well in the future, but only if some get more than a few views. As long as nobody sees them because there just aren't enough people visiting SW and too few people browse the new submission, why bother?
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Dock, on 10/22/2007 3:37:19 PM
Total Posts: 1486, Joined: 11/12/2005
@ Killmeman

It's so crappy that you put your videos on here? Mhmm. ;)

@ Peenmaster

That's the key. We'll be trying to find ways to make it easier and faster for you guys to submit everything: links, video uploads, pictures and blog entries.

Hopes are by everyone being able to browse by category as well, in sections they are interested in, it will make it easier for you to shout the content you like.

Until this weekend's quick dive in content and traffic from the site going down for OVER AN ENTIRE DAY, browsing and submissions have been far increased but can still greatly improve. Shouts, video uploads and blog entries can still use more participation.

It will optimally work when more folks are actively browsing, discussing and submitting cool stuff they may come across.

We'll keep working on this end to make the site faster, free of crappy ads and easier to submit to and browse. Also, always give feedback.

Bulshoy, Zero and myself have our contact emails in our profiles, you have a chat where you can drop us messages and you can also hit us up on the forums (when it's back online).

Whenever you have a question or concern, drop us a line. We'll always look into stuff for you, do our best to get the features you deserve and respond to concerns.

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